Torque Game Engine

[Shivers]

I am strongly considering (almost definetly gonna) using the Torque game engine for a game I, and a few others are working on. There are a few concerns i have. How well does it support urban and indoor environments? How good is the mac support? Is this only way to import 3d models and animations through a windows user with 3dsmax or milkshape?

I would really like some info addressing those concerns or anything else about the engine I should know.

thanks

[Carlos Camacho]

Some uDevGame 2002 winners got Torque as prizes. Hopefully they will respond. If not, I can ask GG directly.

[David]

I tried out Torque but haven't tried making anything in it. The indoor rendering is fine but there only seem to be dynamic shadows from distant lights, and I don't think it supports very high-poly modelled environments too well. The mac support seems fine, they have forums and respond to e-mails, and it compiles perfectly for me.

[griffin239]

I have had Torque for a long time, but haven't used it, mostly because of uDevGame.

A mac user can use the DTS exporter from www.gnometech.com
to export Lightwave models into Torque.

Outdoor scenes are very well supported. Recently someone posted
the source modifications for space based games as well.
Building indoor enviroments does not see very difficult, I made some
tunnels by simply slapping slabs inbetween landscape valleys,
made a bunch of stone henge-ish shapes, some super high poly
cylinder/tunnels.

I ran into a problem with my bots however, if they were inside an
object the game lagged much as the bots were scanning for
every possible escape route from the interior....at least thats
what it seems was the problem.

It would be great if more Mac users got into Torque.
Would be nice if we focused on better level building tools and 3D format
convertors to get more Mac apps to work with the engine.

I assume you've played Realm Wars? Its free and the level editor is built in.
Just play the game and hit F11, I think.
I used to have some tutorials online, but they seem to have gone missing.

It's fairly easy to master the basics....and there is tons and tons of information
at the Garage Games site, enough to keep you busy for a long time.

[Frank C.]

The indoor environments in Torque can be compiled from files in Quake compatible ".map" format (GG recommends the WorldCraft editor for the PC). During the Mac Torque beta test, I "ported" the WorldCraft Torque entity defs for use with Quiver, which can be had here: http://planetquake.com/paroxysm/torque_quiver.sit

I don't think the Torque BSP compiler has been ported yet, so exported maps will still need to be compiled on a PC, or with Virtual PC. Note that Quiver only exports the ".map" format if registered, and I'm not sure if new registrations are being accepted (YMMV).

The MacOSX port of GtkRadiant (when it's released) should also export compatible maps as long as some restraint is used when editing - i.e. no patches or fancy texcoords.

[Shivers]

Cool, looks good. THat is annoying that the game lags in indoor environments because the game will have a lot of indoors that I am working on. We wont have very high poly counts so that is alright. What is the advantage of making maps externally?

[macboy]

Originally posted by Shivers
What is the advantage of making maps externally?I don't have Torque or have even used it, but I'd guess it would probably be faster/easier.

[griffin239]

Its not that Torque lags on the indoor in general..its the script of my bots searching for player and or nearest way point...that is the issue. they are scanning all over the place looking for a way out.

If you weren't to use the generic bot script set up from the forums, you could control the bots
to only be looking within there general area for the player only, instead of trying to run across miles of planet to find the player.

[Shivers]

cool, sounds good. The game will take place in a city, some buildings will be enterable. How do you think that will work?

[AJ Infinity]

have a 'hot spot' by the door. The door doesn't open, it's just a static model. The player touches the hot spot and the indoor map is loaded into memory. The outdoor map is removed from memory and the indoor map is rendered. Simple.

Torque's so darn good, I've decided to use it for Rageflight and AJ Infinity. (It's cheaper than the $1000 Shockwave Director Studio)

Torque's price and scripting surely beat making your own engine.

Shivers, go to http://www.garagegames.com/pg/product/view.php?id=1 and scroll down till you see the heading Technical. Under this heading, it says that people are making tools that allow other people to use apps like Maya and LightWave with Torque.

I'm going to have to modify Torque for Rageflight so that LightWave motion data files can be used. And so that I can have deformable terrain (craters, etc.)

[macboy]

Here's my off-topic-ness for the day:

AJ, no offense, but why do you keep making separate posts? Just edit your last one. If you do it right after (about a min or so) it won't say it was edited so nobody will ever know the difference.

[griffin239]

How to do intereiors in torque?
Big interior models
shouldn't be a problem

you should be able to get to work
with a lightwave demo
dts exporter from www.gnometech.com
and RealmWars

change the player.dts
or weapon.dts
or add some itemname.dts of your very own
like a buildingexterior.dts
floor1.dts
etc

actually for interiors Torque uses a different format.
of which format support I have not seen.

But I got away with using the dts models fairly well.

If you can understand Torque Scripting, and C++ which I believe it is written.
Then you can go very very far. Just jumping from whats already done.
No need to design a server, keyboard prefs, opening screens, editor....etc.

But there is need to get say Meshwork models, 3DS models, etc into the appropriate
Torque format.

Once you get your license, spend a few days on the forums at Garage Games, in the
Resources. Your mind will expand, your purchase will increase in value as well.
For instance, stock out of the box, Torque demo is just running around some mountains with a gun. In resources you can learn to turn it into a bot vs player gauntlet, spaceship simulator, race track derby, etc.

Anything should be possible.

[Shivers]

sweet thanks alot for the info. My PMU died so i need to get a new computer before i get Torque:eek:

[Cyberpawz]

Originally posted by griffin239
How to do intereiors in torque?
Big interior models
shouldn't be a problem

you should be able to get to work
with a lightwave demo
dts exporter from www.gnometech.com
and RealmWars

change the player.dts
or weapon.dts
or add some itemname.dts of your very own
like a buildingexterior.dts
floor1.dts
etc

actually for interiors Torque uses a different format.
of which format support I have not seen.

But I got away with using the dts models fairly well.

If you can understand Torque Scripting, and C++ which I believe it is written.
Then you can go very very far. Just jumping from whats already done.
No need to design a server, keyboard prefs, opening screens, editor....etc.

But there is need to get say Meshwork models, 3DS models, etc into the appropriate
Torque format.

Once you get your license, spend a few days on the forums at Garage Games, in the
Resources. Your mind will expand, your purchase will increase in value as well.
For instance, stock out of the box, Torque demo is just running around some mountains with a gun. In resources you can learn to turn it into a bot vs player gauntlet, spaceship simulator, race track derby, etc.

Anything should be possible.

Since it seems you know a lot about this engine, i have two thing to ask...

1. Bot scripting...lagging because of looking/searching... could this be fixed with streamlining the coding?

2. Torque engine can use up to 64 players (if I remeber correctly) in one server, any chance to fix it to do more?

Cyberpawz

[griffin239]

I'm sorry I missed notifcation on these questions all this time.

64 players is a very high number of players for $100
assume you can easily run 7 levels on 7 cheap pcs and a T1
you have 7 x 64 for your $100 license if you develop something
you want to show to the world.
You are making applications via Torque source.

All this code is open to you to USE,but you don't have to depend
only on it,you could say have something its missing and
you work it in.

I'm not a programmer but i scripted and compiled the bot code
from their forums..it was not easy but I did it. Yes the bots could
have more AI. My bots are dumb as hell. all they do is try desperately
to see the player, run to him, kill him.

I have a license for artistic purposes, that means I wanted to design
levels and learn to hack a game together. I had a great time,
raising mountains, gouging valleys, planting spaceships and temples.

I'd like to get back to it but team work to me is vital.

Anyone have torque?

[Cyberpawz]

Originally posted by griffin239
I'm sorry I missed notifcation on these questions all this time.

64 players is a very high number of players for $100
assume you can easily run 7 levels on 7 cheap pcs and a T1
you have 7 x 64 for your $100 license if you develop something
you want to show to the world.
You are making applications via Torque source.


Lets put it this way, 64 players is enough for a demo...in which I would be willing to design using the Torque engine... but the full engine we are going to be using, as the programer right now is working on, is going to be handling over 300 users at one shot...yes a lot of headaches, but he is positive he can do it.

Originally posted by griffin239

All this code is open to you to USE,but you don't have to depend
only on it,you could say have something its missing and
you work it in.

I'm not a programmer but i scripted and compiled the bot code
from their forums..it was not easy but I did it. Yes the bots could
have more AI. My bots are dumb as hell. all they do is try desperately
to see the player, run to him, kill him.

I have a license for artistic purposes, that means I wanted to design
levels and learn to hack a game together. I had a great time,
raising mountains, gouging valleys, planting spaceships and temples.

I'd like to get back to it but team work to me is vital.

Anyone have torque?

Well if you are seriously looking to get back into a project, I have an opening...as of now, no money to be had, but if we get a demo, and a partner, I see it coming though.

I need someone who can code, at least a basic bot, and have the ability to do character renders, etc...

If you are intersted, or want to know more, E-mail me... or PM me, and I will be sure to respond...

I don't have a job so for me it's easy to respond easy... I have a tech writer dealing with my works as we speak for the documents, so I can give you what I have edited, but if you want the unedited info, I can give that too, but to get that far we need to talk, and be on the same page..

I will get the torque engine if given a good enough reason to, next to the price...

This is going to me interesting as well due to the fact it needs to be programed in Objective C.

Cyberpawz

[griffin239]

Torque is multi-platform but Cocoa isn't. Why go Cocoa?

You should be able to build a very basic demo using Realm Wars.

Deformable Scenery, ala, craters is easy enough in Torque by
loading height maps and applying them to the scenery mesh.
Greyscale images in combination will create fairly complex
terrains. It just takes some learning.

If you are even considering Torque, Realm Wars is a quick
route to creating a demo that says "my game will look like this",
even if it does't have all the mechanics in place yet, like a
300 client server.

I'm not soliciting work, I'm looking to share Torque info and
hopefully learn something in the process. I'm new to programming.

[Cyberpawz]

Originally posted by griffin239
Torque is multi-platform but Cocoa isn't. Why go Cocoa?

You should be able to build a very basic demo using Realm Wars.

Deformable Scenery, ala, craters is easy enough in Torque by
loading height maps and applying them to the scenery mesh.
Greyscale images in combination will create fairly complex
terrains. It just takes some learning.

If you are even considering Torque, Realm Wars is a quick
route to creating a demo that says "my game will look like this",
even if it does't have all the mechanics in place yet, like a
300 client server.

I'm not soliciting work, I'm looking to share Torque info and
hopefully learn something in the process. I'm new to programming.

The reason for Cocoa, is becuase that is what the programer wants to do it in...and since I don't know programing, I'm a little letf to the whims of what he can do...

And the use for Cocoa, is because I want this to be a Mac first game...then port it over.

As for realm wars, I will have to look into it, thanks for the advice...

this is going to be a very complex system to say the least.

Cyberpawz

[AJ Infinity]

Thanks for showing me that LightWaveToDTS plugin, Griffin. It also allows LW Modeler to export to OBJ, 3DS, and DXF. I'm really happy now/ :D (See?)

[LC Alchemist]

Does anyone have any suggestions about making a 3d RPG with torque?

ie:
* a multiple-choice dialogue interface thingo that is triggered when you click on someone/thing or move into a certain area
*etc.

[Shivers]

it could be done...but you would need to know c++. It would be just like making an RPG minus making the real-time renderer and landscape editor...it would take alot of editing of source

[griffin239]

I think plenty of Torque developers have some RPG in production.
Realm Wars has all the trappings of an RPG, only its a FPS right now.

No matter what you do with Torque you will be editing source.

[Shivers]

its true that you are always gonna end up editing source, but an RPG is a lot more editting:p

realm wars is an RPG without the RPG?

[griffin239]

Yes you will always edit the source.

The current version of Realm Wars has two roles to play
guy with ammo
and
guy who is running for the ammo

A tragic comedy in two parts.

[Shivers]

heh

the idea of the community project is good, has anyone here considered doing something like that. It could be quite a way to get publicity

[griffin239]

Inkubator?