Starting salary article

[LongJumper]

Just read the article on the front page. I'm about halfway through a computer science degree at the University of Wisconsin(the big one), I was wondering...what kind of jobs are they talking about? Just programming, I take it? I thought I wouldn't be making decent money for awhile. Anyone with a comp sci degree know whats up, what kind of jobs are available?

[DaFalcon]

I imagine it is all jobs out of college with that degree, on average

(there would be many other factors too, of course, including cost of living in the area of your job, other experience, your grades/performance in school .... this really just gives you an idea of whether things are going up or down, and a basic relative salary indicator)

[blobbo]

Orchestral Musician starting salaries are dirt. Think about $10,000US. When you make it up the ladder (which involves auditioning for exactly 2-3 minutes (no exaggeration) along with 300 other violinists playing the same excerpts of music for a single job), salaries run up quickly. Cleveland orchestra - possibly one of the best in the world (probably top 3, at least), has a base salary of $90,000US.

[SOUR-Monkey]

I am quite surprised by those figures. I can't imagine they will be particularly accurate in NZ, or you'd be starting at $70 000/year. No way.

Although, I won't be complaining if that is the case...

[blobbo]

When you consider the amount of training that I go through to become a professional musician (I've played since I've been 3, practised about 2-4h every day for the past 10 years, about an hour/day every day for about 4 years before that). Now I'm a senior in my B.Mus, and auditioning for Masters degrees this year. Intense.

[FCCovett]

Even if you have a doctor's degree in music, the changes are that you'd get about $25k a year from teaching full-time in a college (what takes a long time and the right connections to get), $35 to $100/h for private classes, and then you'd have to keep traveling to some Asian country to teach master classes for about $100 per head. Now, you could try to record and sell your albums, and compose and record for advertising and films, or organize some lame competitions, to complement your income.

[blobbo]

Now hold on, FCCovett. With a Doctorate or even a Masters in music, you can get an excellent job as a professor of music at a university, and make a ton of money. I'm talking classical music here, stuff that you've been highly trained at, and have a high degree of knowledge about. There's a real field for the stuff - most musicians, regardless of genre, benefit from the knowledge of music as a whole.

[FCCovett]

With a Doctorate or even a Masters in music, you can get an excellent job as a professor of music at a university, and make a ton of money.

I have met a few people with a master's or doctor's degrees in classical music and it seems the good teaching jobs are not coming by that easily. Honestly, none of their professors seem to be making a ton of money either. I would say the most successful ones make about $60k/year, if they just teach.

I have a close friend who graduated in film scoring from Berkelee. Now, he runs his own studio, composing and recording mostly for adversiting and documentaries. By far, he's faring a lot better than any of other guys. I've seen him receiving $10k for composing and arranging just one jingle. He doesn't have a master's degree though.

I have another friend who's got a master's in classical piano (Russia) and another in language (US). She was teaching private classes of piano, Spanish at a community college, performing at especial events, and selling her own albums. She makes about $25k/year.

This link gives some numbers: http://stats.bls.gov/oco/ocos066.htm

"Median annual earnings of all postsecondary teachers in 2002 were $49,040. The middle 50 percent earned between $34,310 and $69,580. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $23,080, and the highest 10 percent earned more than $92,430.

According to a 2002-03 survey by the American Association of University Professors, salaries for full-time faculty averaged $64,455.

By rank, the average was $86,437 for professors, $61,732 for associate professors, $51,545 for assistant professors, $37,737 for instructors, and $43,914 for lecturers.

Faculty in 4-year institutions earn higher salaries, on average, than do those in 2-year schools. In 2002-03, average faculty salaries in public institutionsó$63,974ówere lower than those in private independent institutionsó$74,359óbut higher than those in religiously affiliated private colleges and universitiesó$57,564.

In fields with high-paying nonacademic alternativesómedicine, law, engineering, and business, among othersóearnings exceed these averages. In othersósuch as the humanities and educationóthey are lower.

Earnings for postsecondary career and technical education teachers vary widely by subject, academic credentials, experience, and region of the country. Part-time instructors usually receive few benefits."

"The following tabulation shows postsecondary teaching jobs in specialties having 20,000 or more jobs in 2002:

Graduate teaching assistants: 128,000
Vocational education teachers: 119,000
Health specialties teachers: 86,000
Business teachers: 67,000
Art, drama, and music teachers: 58,000
English language and literature teachers: 55,000
Education teachers: 42,000
Biological science teachers: 47,000
Mathematical science teachers: 41,000
Nursing instructors and teachers: 37,000
Computer science teachers: 33,000
Engineering teachers: 29,000
Psychology teachers: 26,000"

[blobbo]

Of course, teaching privately you do not make a sustainable income because you simply don't have the hours. I don't know what the payscale for university music professors is, but I'd assume it's definitely enough to live on, especially if you have a Doctorate...

Ah well, I want to be an orchestral musician anyway. Great perks.

[FCCovett]

I can't think of any job in the US that requires a college degree but doesn't pay enough to live on. In the case of private classes, if you have each student paying you $100/mo. for about 45 min/week of lessons, you can make about $2,000/mo. working pretty much 3 days a week. :)

A doctorate in music performance in one of the top ten music schools should cost you about $25,000, but there really are no guarantees that you are going to get a job in an university or in an orchestra. It'll depend greatly on your talent and on your connections, as it pretty much happens in any other field.

[blobbo]

And most importantly, your audition. Talent plays very little part in getting a job in a symphony. You're right about "who you know" - certainly this applies to a situation like Cleveland Orchestra, where auditions are invitation-only.

$100/3h of work is pretty bad pay for a private teacher. I myself charge $34/h CAN, and I'm only a senior in my B.Mus. Still, it's a lot of work to keep organised, and you still don't manage to get enough of a salary to be considered "good pay." A music teacher who teaches privately makes about $30,000 a year CAN, which isn't particularily terrific.

And you're absolutely correct that a Doctorate in music doesn't get you a job. I'd say most practical teachers in university (practical as in teaching playing, as oppose to theory and history, which fall into different fields than playing) get their posts through how well they play, or what positions they hold in the symphonies of their respective cities. Certainly with well known conservatories (Cleveland Institute of Music, Julliard, New England Conservatory, Manhattan School of Music), this is the case.

In any case, if you make it in the states, music is a pretty good job. Great pay, great perks, and you do what you love all day long and get payed for it. Terrific!