uDG Website Issues

⌘-R in Chief
Posts: 1,277
Joined: 2002.05
Post: #1
Note from MOD (Hairball183): This is split from another post. The purpose of this post it to discuss issues with the current uDG website. While these issues do need to be discussed, this should not turn into a flame-war. Keep it civil.


So I've finally just looked at the much belated voting system and I think this sums up my thoughts: Cry

I apologize in advance, but this was the proverbial straw that has completely broken my spirit.

Carlos Camacho Wrote:* You don't need to vote for your own game. If you did, don't fret, I'll just remove your vote.

Don't need to? Shouldn't be allowed to...

Quote:* All votes, whether by dev or public is logged with IP. Please don't spread misinformation.
* It may seem that you can vote for a game more than once, but multi votes is in fact not saved.

IP only is a weak weak weak weak system. A simple "don't allow duplicates" prevents some people from actually voting at all, and lets other vote as many times as they want.

Not to mention anyone with the URL can go and vote in the developer categories...

Are you going to go in and grab the IPs of every developer and purge any others? That's going to be an absolute nightmare with most people using dynamic IPs and voting for different games at different times.

Quote:I'm not completely satisfied with the system. But it was paid for in '03 so I'd like to get our ROI on it.

You paid for it? Cry

2003? The html looks like it's from 1993.

Quote:Sites pretty good IMHO. I'd like to keep tweaking it and making it better.

Someone's gotta say it: The site is a total flop. I don't care to go into the enumerating everything that's wrong with it, but the major things are the organization being wonky (particularly with a separate "gallery" rather than putting the screenshots on the actual entry pages), and there also being two different systems and two completely different apperances of two major halves of the site (and that doesn't even include the voting which is an entirely different appearance). Not to mention logging into the admin backend and promising not to touch certain fields in order to update your own entry...

And to think that all of these systems were paid for... that's mind boggling.

Nearly the entire website is a total loss IMO.

Quote:* We were able to get a great number of sponsors with some very nice prizes. 'Selling' the contest isn't an easy role... especially considering the economy.

I was suprised at some of the support we got, considering the state of everything. iDevGames.com is STILL a ghost town - http://www.idevgames.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15058 , and uDevGames at the start of the contest was pretty haphazzardly organized and incomplete.

Quote:* We haven't had an editor completely burnt out at the end of the contest for once. For the most part, it's been a pleasure -- very different from the heavy stress of past contests.

It's been stressing the crap out of me.

Not even having a voting system up by the time voting was supposed to start?? There were three months to do that. I spent about three hours the-day-of and came up with a pretty slick system, but instead we're using this... mess.

Quote:OK, so let's focus on the positive and give a round of applause to the developers who made it to the end of the contest, while encouraging those that didn't to keep at it, and those that may consider someone entering to jump right in.

Absolutely. I'm just afraid that the systems setup for the website and voting, the execution of the rules, and trying to revive the prestige of the contest was a flop.

When uDG '08 looked like it was going to happen (you said you wanted to do one http://www.idevgames.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15516 ) I tried to step up and help. I gathered sponsors contact info, I hearded cats over 5 days and crafted rules, I offered to write and even host the website to save money, I even offered to host some of binaries so entrants wouldn't be bombarded by traffic loads during voting and the public wouldn't have to go through any hassle on "free downloads hosting sites" (there were also other community members willing to share bandwidth and donate to any costs), and I even wrote a voting system at the last minute just voting could actually start on time, but every single one of my offers (OUR offers, actually, as there were others) was turned down, and I have to say the result is Annoyed .

I'm glad the contest happened, and I sincerely appreciate the effort you put into it, but from my perspective I think almost every single thing about this contest could have been done better, and I don't think any amout of "tweaking" is going to help solve fundamental problems.
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Posts: 715
Joined: 2003.04
Post: #2
Ok response moved from this thread this thread

FreakSoftware Wrote:I sent Carlos an email offering to help and was turned down.
Its the being burned thing.
A person doesn't put his faith too easily in people after it fries him.

I've completely stopped looking for help for iGame3D after dozens
of promises, ten dozen demands for features fulfilled, and then
an echoing silence as reply to my emails.

So I can relate to his point of view, and now you, I think are feeling much the same thing.

There's a psychology to all this stuff.

You did your part, you wanted to do more and because you were snubbed
you are disappointed. Just like a grandma who feels bad when the daughter in
law doesn't let her do everything she thinks is best for the kiddies.
Or a father who can't convince his daughter not to date the wrong guys until she figures it out for herself.
Or a good friend of someone who is on a downward spiral.
You try your best to guide, but everyone has their own path to take.

You have to look at it the way Carlos looks
at the contest and site vs. the negativity...if you helped just one
person get their game out or get off their rear end, then you have
been successful. If you compare it all to high ideals, you'll be let down,
if you look for the little things that really matter, you've done well.

Its the way I look at iGame3D. I set out to be a god like the Unity crew.
If I see that I am not a god , then woe and sorrow.
But when Tobi tells me that his college offered him a job
because they are impressed with his OpenGL skills, then
wow, thats the "at the very least you'll get a job out of this someday"
promise I made seven years ago fulfilled. Success!

Its a matter of perspective.

So find your high ground and see things for the mountain you've climbed,
instead of straining eyes and neck to prospect the entire
range you set out to conquer.

If you look at my game this time around, you see what?
A zombie romp in 3D.
But you have no idea that game is a dream come true for me.
So all my bluster aside, thanks.

All of ones accomplishments are not always readily apparent.
And sometimes when you are pushing someone to succeed they
only see you as a slave driving task master.
Its not until they have surpassed their expectations and self conceived
limitations that they can appreciate your effort.

Ok I hope that helps somehow, if not today, then down the line.
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Posts: 460
Joined: 2002.09
Post: #3

Given the work you've been willing to contribute to uDevGames, would it be possible for you to run a contest yourself? There's room for more. Contest-related discussions could still be hosted on iDevGames' message boards so you wouldn't have to build a community from scratch, and there wouldn't have to be an acrimonious rift in the community either.

Who knows, if your hosting and voting system works out maybe future contests could also use it.

For better or for worse, Carlos runs uDevGames and doesn't always find a way to divide the labor, and indeed has gotten burned on occasion when he did. I think it's best to let him run this particular contest as he will. But I think he'd give his blessing to someone who actually ran a contest themselves rather than complain (which frankly is what most of us do.)

Just a thought.

Measure twice, cut once, curse three or four times.
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⌘-R in Chief
Posts: 1,277
Joined: 2002.05
Post: #4
Believe me, we've thought about and discussed this and more (we being me and other regulars). I feel that talking about it on iDevGames.com itself isn't appropriate. Smile
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Posts: 715
Joined: 2003.04
Post: #5
Kind of off the 'main' topic in here but still in line with "issues".
This bit should be removed frome the UDG front page.

Quote:The Best Overall Game is demonstrated at MacWorld's Mac OS X Arcade.

Apple will not be returning to Macworld and if history is shades of the future,
Macworld itself will die after the 2010 incarnation.
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Post: #6
FreakSoftware Wrote:Believe me, we've thought about and discussed this and more (we being me and other regulars). I feel that talking about it on iDevGames.com itself isn't appropriate. Smile

If someone wants to run their own contest then there really isn't much to stop them, is all I was saying, and it sounded like you had willingness and the right skill set.


Measure twice, cut once, curse three or four times.
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